My 45:70 Marlin. MANY years ago I managed to break the stock on this wonderful rifle and have been unable to acquire a new one (even though it has been on my ‘present list’ for close on 20 years). To my surprise my wonderful family managed to source one for my birthday yesterday. I’m not sure whether I am now too old for this rifle. It IS a blunderbuss (and quite heavy), but we shall see. At least Matt and/or Bryn may enjoy the use of it. Originally this was the round which wiped out the American bison. It was then (as now) .45 calibre (ie 45/100ths of an inch) and was loaded with 70 grains of black powder. NOW you can load (a modern version of the rifle) up with over 80 grains of modern chemical propellent and 500 grains (that’s half an ounce) of copper-jacketed lead. It comes out of the barrel at over 3,000 feet per second and is still going nearly as fast as a ‘baby’ .308 @ 100 yards, but with immensely more kinetic energy. When the projectile mushrooms out, you would have to see the damage to believe it: it is awesome. Small game (wallaby size) just disintegrates! Something the size of a man will have a hole you can push your whole arm through. Anything hit in the chest will be very suddenly, very dead. It is an excellent big game (eg sambar deer) rifle. During the war against the Huk in the Phillipines c1905 American marines brought it back into service as they found (surprisingly) the full metal jacket 30:06 just didn’t have the stopping power for these crazed folks who were completely hyped up on some bizarre concoction of drugs, their gonads tightly wrapped with wet greenhide so they wouldn’t feel any other pain & etc. Allegedly you could shoot them through the heart with a 30:06 solid round and they would still run a 100 yards and chop off your head with a scimitar (you can probably guess at their religion!) The old 45:70 knocked them over backwards and they just didn’t have the ‘heart’ (literally – or much else) to get up again and keep going. I can’t imagine that the current puny .223 round would stop such folks! Perhaps I will stock up on 45:70 ammo!
Hi again Steve,
Sorry to pester you, but I have a few more questions. You see, I thought I “had” a Marlin 336, but it turns out I still have to wait for the police to re-start the firearm safety courses here in our People’s Republic of Victoria, and so that particular gun is no longer available to me. However, it turns out a dealer in my town has a new 336C in 30-30 for around $1200 anyway, so if it’s still available when I get my licence I can just buy that one. But because I am working from home and have too much time on my hands, I have been looking around and am considering other choices too. I am a left-hander, and as I said, I would like to start by hunting with open sights. Unfortunately these constraints limit my options significantly. The different options remaining are quite different in price. For example, the Marlin, a Browning BLR .308 (around $2000), or I have been offered a Tikka T3 Battue (fibre-optic open sights), right-handed(!), for $1300 with poly stock or $1500 with a very-nice wooden stock. I know you shoot the Browning BLR, and seem to like it a lot. However, I have read a lot about encountering Sambar in the dawn/dusk period am so am concerned about target aquisition in these low-light conditions, which is why I like the fibre-optic sights. I have shouldered the Tikka Battue – it’s very nice, and the sights would seem to make target acquisition very quick, as well as being helpful in low-light. To the questions: 1. Do you find the iron sights on the Browning (I think the Marlin sights are very similar) inadequate or difficult in low-light conditions? 2. Do you think it would be folly to buy a right-handed bolt gun (it does have an “ambidextrous” stock, so it’s more a question of the speed or otherwise follow-up shots, I think)) as a left-hander? 3. Do you find that the BLR in .308 has a lot of recoil?, 4. Given the choices available, do you still think the Marlin is adequate for the job (the Browning is lovely but rather spendy, and I have to buy other gear too, like ultra-light day packs and hammocks!)? 5. Am I over-thinking this?
Cheers, Paul
You can change the front sight on practically any gun. However read this post: https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2018/01/11/night-sights/ and the comments. The paint helps. Seems like a lot of money for a 30:30. Just a quick look here http://www.ozgunsales.com/searchresults.php?searchtext=30-30 and seems to me you can pick one up for < $700. I would have thought < $500. The difference in price will buy you all the other lightweight gear I will be recommending (still working on that post - and a few others). I have shot more deer with a .303 I bought for $50 many years ago than practically anything else - and it is still good for hundreds more! Here is a preview: Ultralight Ultracheap Deer Hunting: I am often approached by novice deer hunters for advice particularly about what they need to acquire before beginning hunting. How little both in weight and dollars do you need to spend (supposing you already actually own nothing - unlikely)? I have put together here some of my suggestions from previous posts:1. Pack: 260 grams: US$ 14 (May 2020): Such a pack as the Superlight Hunting Pack just stripped down from its bought weight of 305 grams to 260 grams, less if you have some sewing skills. Some other cheap backpacks.2. Tent/Shelter. Perhaps this Ultralight Ultracheap Rain Fly 308 grams and US$ 28.43 (May 2020). It comes with guys and pegs (at a total of 403 grams). Some other cheap tents. I have suggested before how useful a $10 blue poly tarp is. You might need a $2 space blanket as a ground sheet!3. Sleeping Mat. Perhaps this R4.2 Vertex mat at 450 grams and US$39.99 (Feb 2020) Of course if you have to you can make do - but your (warm comfy) mat is your best investment in a pleasant trip. For years I used the Thermarest Neoair X-Lite Womens at around 340 grams and an R-rating of 5.4 which I still think is a great pad but am now using the Exped Synmat HL Winter which is nearly 4" thick of wonderful comfort and has a simlar R-rating (5.2). Check out mat R-ratings here.4. Sleeping Bag. I like a bag that is around 500 grams and around -1C. If you have some warm clothes,and a warm mat that is usually enough. This cheap down mat is worth considering. You can buy an approx 0C 600 gram 800 FP down bag from Aliexpress for around US$80.Gun. All you need is something in a legal deer calibre which will knock down sambar deer. Likely more deer have been shot with a 303 SMLE than any other calibre ever invented though probably few use them now. They are available quite cheaply though and are just about unbreakable and have terrific sights. Sporterised they are quite a good weight too. Another cheap alternative is a Winchester 30:30 lever action with those excellent buckhorn sights. They may be considered a little light on but if you hit a big guy in the chest he is not going far.See Also:https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2020/04/30/superlight-hunting-pack-193-grams/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2018/02/17/ultralight-ultracheap-backpack/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2020/04/26/ultralight-ultracheap-rain-fly/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2018/09/17/two-great-cheap-tents/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2017/02/01/poly-tent-by-the-ultralight-hiker-on-the-cheap/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2020/02/23/another-cheap-hiking-mat/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2018/09/10/make-your-sleeping-pad-warmer/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2020/01/14/sleeping-pad-news/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2018/08/15/womens-are-great-in-bed/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2018/06/30/exped-synmat-hl-winter-m/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2020/01/01/cheap-down/
This post continues a series about budget hiking. Here are some of the others:
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2019/11/30/best-5-spent-on-camping-gear-ever/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2018/03/03/ultralight-hiking-on-a-budget/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2018/03/24/budget-pack-mods/
https://www.theultralighthiker.com/2019/09/07/60-diy-ultralight-hiker-ideas/
Hi there. This may be a silly question, but do you think can I hunt sambar with a 30-30, if I hunt within the limitations of the rifle and my abilities? I have a Marlin 336, and would look at using 170 grain Winchester powerpoint rounds. I have a lot of experience with bowhunting – but never sambar – and am keen get as close as possible and to only use open sights, so I would probably limit myself to 100m maximum distance shots. However, do you think 30-30 too “weak” a cartridge for this magnificent animal?
Hi Paul, I am just working on a post (Ultralight Ultracheap Deer Hunting) where I have already written this in the draft: ‘Gun. All you need is something in a legal deer calibre which will knock down sambar deer. Likely more deer have been shot with a 303 SMLE than any other calibre ever invented though probably few use them now. They are available quite cheaply though and are just about unbreakable and have terrific sights. Sporterised they are quite a good weight too. Another cheap alternative is a Winchester 30:30 lever action with those excellent buckhorn sights. They may be considered a little light on but if you hit a big guy in the chest he is not going far.’ My kids all used one. I would even consider going back to one because of its lightness. I wonder whether you can get carbon stocks for one? That would make it lighter still (but dearer – though not if you made it yourself!) They hold a heap of bullets – more than the magazine capacity on new rifles for some mysterious reason, so you can certainly keep pumping them out. A safety feature I like (with lever actions) is that you can leave the breach empty but get a round into it very quickly – as you bring the rifle up to your shoulder. Up close most shots are going to be on moving deer. I have shot a sambar stag eight times in th chest and had him still standing with a .306. He was dead after the first one but didn’t want to admit it! I admit this makes me feel awful but it happen=s sometimes. I think a 30:30 will be fine for a first, cheap light rifle. Good luck with your hunting. Cheers, Steve.
Hi Steve. Thanks for your prompt and thoughtful reply. I really like your deer hunting philosophy – that’s why I wrote to you. Most guys I talk to tell me that a 30-30 is “only a fun gun” for shooting bottles or the odd pig, and laughed at my idea of a light carbine with open sights. A lot of “gun people” recommend what amounts to a cannon with some sort of very complicated and expensive optic system of one sort or another. One guy even boasted to me he uses thermal image binoculars, and that they could “pick up a mouse in the forest.” Needless to say, I didn’t speak with him about the subject again. It’s like these guys are techno-rationalists who only care about getting the “kill” at any cost, and without having to work overly hard for it. I am more interested in getting out in the high country as often as possible, learning about deer, seeing plenty of them, and maybe shooting one if it crosses my path close enough – or maybe not! I’ll only know when the time comes. Anyway, thanks for your blog – it has given my mate and I (who will be hunting buddies) a lot of sensible food for thought. Cheers, Paul.
Hi Again Paul, Always great to link up with ethical hunters. The best way to get away from the other sort of people is to leave your car and backpack in to a spot they will not day-hunt from a vehicle. Then you will be undisturbed. There is an open-necked 30:30 the Winchester .375 I think it is called (which has been hard to get ammunition for in this country for years. It is just the same weight and action, but has a much larger bullet. If you check its performance you will see that it is doing just as well at 100 metres as a .308 which some people still think is not big enough. I have hit a deer in the chest with a 45:70 at 20 yards and it did not even pause for 200 yards. Nothing to do with the gun. Just as many one shot kills with a 30:30 when they were very popular as with the bigger guns. You could cut the tubular magazine down also to save weight if you wanted. Steel is heavy. As I said I am working on a new post about Ultracheap Ultralight deer hunting but it is mainly a compilation of earlier suggestions. You don’t have to break the bank. In the past I have known many very successful stalkers who did not own a 4WD. They were happy to walk. There are plenty of areas where doggers may not (legally) hunt and which are too big for many people because of limited access – wilderness areas etc which you can as easily reach with a 2WD since you will have to walk in anyway. If you only take the best meat out, don’t worry overmuch. There are groups who are slaughtering 20-50 deer in a day who are taking nothing but antlers. If you type ‘deer’ into the search facility on the bottom left of my page you will get many suggestions of things to read. Happy hunting. Cheers, Steve.